A bit of background regarding the Ralph Lauren 'Pink Pony' collection for those who are unfamiliar
Ralph Lauren started the 'Pink Pony' fund to raise money for various organisations around the glove. Most of the funds are supporting breast-cancer and cancer related foundations.
When people purchase a Pink Pony item from the collection, 10% of the sales is donated to the Pink Pony Fund. In turn, Ralph Lauren designates the funds to his chosen charities. Yes, I'm talking about Ralph Lauren THE PERSON, not the company as a whole.
For over a year or so now, the Pink Pony's have been sold on eBay and other places outside of Ralph Lauren stores and Polo.com.
Over this time, I've realised that the proceeds from these sales (outside of Ralph Lauren) are not really going towards the Pink Pony Fund. There is just NO WAY IN HELL that these wholesalers selling Pink Pony items for $15-20 are donating any proceeds to Pink Pony Funds. Imagine that, only $1.5-$2 would be donated to the Fund at that price range. And if we think about it further, the wholesalers and manufacturers are probably not even passing on the proceeds to the foundation.
I've personally sold a batch of Pink Pony tees a long time ago. I guess I was naive and a bit ignorant. Its only these past few months when I have been wholesaling myself that I realise the Pink Ponys on the internet are either all fakes or do not actually support the Pink Pony fund.
For those who have dealt with, or are considering dealing with Pink Pony's, then please ask yourself this question. Do you really want to steal from charity and funds for critical cancer research?
What we are doing is lining the pockets of the Asian manufacturers, and not those who really need it. Thats my view. What's everyone elses?
goWholesale Forums » Wholesale Buyers » General Chat
The Ralph Lauren 'Pink Pony' debate
37 posts
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I asked myself this question as well a while back after selling a batch. I just wondered how other folks had felt about it too?
Thanks for stating it so eloquently -
There's two ways of looking at this either it's a hand on heart genuine gesture by RL or it's a shrewd marketing ploy which not only will increase saless in RL pink pony but I reckon it could have a snowball effect right through the brand. If nothing else the RL brand wll have obtained loads of free good guy marketing in many mediums.
I also wonder why the figure is set at 10% why not donate the total profit?
Many people also like to hand pick the charities that they donate to themselves, it's often a decision based on lifes experiences and what affects you the most. In my experience this is certainly so. There are thousands of worthwhile charities out there, (come to think of it what a tough marketplace that is
) its impossible to donate to them all.
Before anybody has a go at me I am NOT saying the cash from this is not going to a good cause, but in the big picture do you not think it's society's responsibility? Should the cancer research campaign be dependant on handouts? -
Nocturnal, the point raised in my post is not about where the proceed are going too, or how this has created a marketting advantage for Ralph Lauren.
rather, I'm talking about people purchasing these Pink Ponys wholesale from a manufacturer. What happens is that NO FUNDS at all are channelled back into the charities and foundations, but instead are lining to pockets of some jerk in India (and the eBay sellers who knowlingly continue to buy and sell these)
When I raised this point with my partner a few weeks ago, we came to the conclusion we should donate all our profits from Pink Pony to a charity. And boy oh boy, thats going to be a lot of money! -
zhenjie I appreciate your point about the ebay sellers, guess this highlights the effect of the fake industry, however I thought it fair to point out an alternative opinion on the RL charity crusade, BTW that's a very generous offer your co. is making any others on here wholesaling RL pink pony want to join him/her ?
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I forgot to say I also agree with your points nocturnal!
I think alot of corporations these days play the good guy image.
I'd really like to see the point of view from people who still continue to manufacture and broker these Pink Pony garments. -
I do think there is a great deal of fake pink pony available. Especially those made in Sri Lanka as they are very thin and cheap. There are also some very nice ones. Authenticity is always a question unless you are used to dealing with the source. As for the 10% I think it is wrong to advertise that 10% of proceeds are going to charity, especially the people who sell them on Ebay. My defense is that the retailer should be the one giving the 10% not the wholesaler because RL gives 10% of the cost on POLO.com not 10% of what they pay the factory. That is my two cents.
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Your Pink Pony pictures and from what I have been told by some of your customers are those from the same source as Ravi and Sri King Line, FTY.
Those as we know have already been declared fake by Ralph Lauren stores.
You know damn well, that all the people you are selling too are NOT donating too charity. Pink Pony should be sold by LEGIT retailers not to some quick-rich stay at home mum who is selling on ebay and has no regards to actual Pink Pony cause. If you had a heart you would stop profiting from Pink Pony. -
<<< You know damn well, that all the people you are selling too are NOT donating too charity. Pink Pony should be sold by LEGIT retailers not to some quick-rich stay at home mum who is selling on ebay and has no regards to actual Pink Pony cause. If you had a heart you would stop profiting from Pink Pony. >>
I dunno ...you could say that about a lot of things. If one "had a heart" one probably wouldn't buy Nike shoes or other items made by children in third world sweatshops. Or stuff from China probably made by slave prison labor. I personally don't care who sells Pink Pony and what they deliver to the charity, as many charities are scams in that half or more of the money goes to administrative costs and such, anyhow. Jerry Lewis made a fortune in the early days of his "Jerry's Kids" schtick until his profiting was brought to light and he was shamed into giving more of it to the charity instead of his pocket. -
Zhenjie,
As a stay at home mom, who is selling on eBay altho not Pink Ponies, I have already explained in the other thread my reasons for having no regards to Ralph Lauren/Pink Pony cause. I thought you would understand. Ok, here goes again, just to alleviate an image of ignorant and self-centered Stay At Home moms:
Reason#1. Unethical conduct of way too many health charities. I mean not only providing their top officials with an opportunity to lead a pleasant and very expensive life, but pouring billions of dollars into experiments that produce no useful results, and even worst may be dangerously misleading. Amongst others, Cancer charities have been involved in several scandals related to sponsoring researches more than questionnable from both scientific and ethical points of view. It is especially true while speaking about drug testing, where interests of large Pharmaceutical Companies are involved and corruption is a serious problem.
Reason#2. Ralph Lauren may be good in publicity, but improving his social image is not in my agenda. It is Ok with me, when one gives 10% of his profit made from inflated prices and such, to a charity and saves some more from taxes. However, for me it is not good enough reason to follow his lead with regard to what charity donate money to. Sorry, I prefer to decide it by myself.
You probably would do some research before doing business with somebody, wouldn't you? It is beyond my understanding why you are ready to give all the profit (not 10%) with no knowledge and no control where all the money actually goes. It is your business, though, not mine.
However, it does not mean that people who think differently should be labeled as heartless or ignorant. They may be just opposite, you know?
Julia -
I find it amusing how people can always make excuses for there own unethical behavior by pointing fingers and saying "well the big foundations are doing it ,so I will too"
I always try to keep one thing in mind, that there is a little thing in life called kharma and everyone who does unethical things always will get it back in the end.
Just my 2 pesos! -
Julia,
If you had a heart you would stop profiting from Pink Pony
That comment was not direct at you and ALL the stay at home mums We are already clear on each others points (and I agree with them too). It was solely focused on Pink Pony sellers. PERIOD.
You are using other excuse to justify the selling of Pink Pony (which is the issue here). -
If the worlds socierty continues to commit illegal acts just because 'they dont want too support corporations' then the whole world would be in shambles. Just look at Software piracy and how rife that is. People justify it becuase they think 'software companies' are making too much money anyway.
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<<< You are using other excuse to justify the selling of Pink Pony (which is the issue here). >>
Are the (unauthorized) resellers of Pink Pony apparel claiming to donate a portion to charity, though? Or are they just offering it for sale? If the former, I believe that would be swindling, and action could probably be taken against them if it were discovered they weren't donating as claimed.
However, my guess is that buyers of (low-priced, counterfeit) Pink Pony apparel couldn't care less about what goes to charity and what doesn't. Maybe they don't even know what Pink Pony is all about. They just like the look. -
mspacman wrote:Are the (unauthorized) resellers of Pink Pony apparel claiming to donate a portion to charity, though? Or are they just offering it for sale?
IMO It doesn't need to advertised or stated that they are donating to charity.
The symbol of the Pink Pony - represents Ralph Laurens generosity to the Breast Cancer Foundation. Pink pony items should come with that tag stating it's proceeds are going towards the foundation, but it's of course not the case with imitations.
The Pink Pony is symbolic of Breast Cancer Awareness.
Just like canteen banners for Cancer, Jeans for Genes day, Red Nose for SIDS and we all know the World Vision symbol... etc..
The value and significant purpose Pink Pony items represent has been lost due to the negligence of those who make and sell Pink Pony without contributing to the charity.
For some people it is all Vanity - what are you saying when you wear/sell a Pink Pony Item?
a) That you support Breast Cancer and contributed 10%
b) It is what sells and makes me lots of money. It also makes people feel and look good - i don't really care if 10% was donated or not.
Besides all that, we can't stop the selfishness, greed and corruption in this world. But you don't have to become a part of it.
We all value different things. What might be unethical to one person, might not be to another person.
It all comes down to how far will your conscience take you? -
Well put waterlily and as I said before theres a little thing called kharma that these people can't escape.
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<<< For some people it is all Vanity - what are you saying when you wear/sell a Pink Pony Item?
a) That you support Breast Cancer and contributed 10%
b) It is what sells and makes me lots of money. It also makes people feel and look good - i don't really care if 10% was donated or not. >>>
c) You're saying the same thing as when wearing any other Ralph Lauren item: "Look at me, I can afford RL, aren't you impressed?"
I put Pink Pony on the same level as Lance Armstrong bracelets and jewelry pieces of red ribbons. Basically, they're fashion statements. Supporting cancer research is secondary. Just like RL's contributions. Making money is is primary reason for the apparel. Making piddly donations off each shirt is a secondary reason. -
<<< theres a little thing called kharma that these people can't escape. >>>
I'm sure you'd like to think that. But the fact is that what goes around sometimes comes around, and sometimes it doesn't. Some people do everything right and never get anything coming around for them. Maybe you mean it comes in the afterlife? Ok, maybe. LOL- and maybe not! -
Zhenjie,
Let's assume that a person, who sells some Pink Ponies on eBay, or a Flea Market, or somewhere, keeps a list of his/her favorite charities and donates each month even more than 10% that would go to the Foundations RL had chosen. Many people keep such lists. Should they be obligated to donate exclusively to the Breast Cancer Foundation (which I would never donate to, because I strongly disagree with their ways of spending money)
Then, there undoubtely are the others, who will never ever donate a penny to anybody for any cause. Does it mean that selling the Pink Pony should be made illegal (it is not yet, as far as I know)? Why only Pink Pony? It would be logical to implement a new tax - "charity tax" or something... and make, say, 2 hours weekly of some volunteer work obligatory to everybody. The only problem is it would kill the very spirit and soul of Philantropy.
You know, it makes me sick sometimes to see people donating without thinking first... they want to help children suffering from cancer, but they are not aware that their donation goes, for example, to fund sewing shut newborn kittens' eyes and killing them afterwards just to prove that blindness affects the brain development somehow - what a scientific breakthrough! Costs a few millions, by the way. If only you had seen some ridiculous, absurd, money and time consuming projects my husband gets to review sometimes, you would not know either to laugh or to cry. Cancer and AIDS are two biggest milk cows in today's medical science, and amongst many honest and valuable research initiatives there are spam and fakes, a lot of them, and they especially like to be sponsored by charities...
I am not for justifying crimes on the ground that Corporations and/or Governments do commit them, too.
I am for as much COMMON SENSE, FREE WILL, and PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, and as little police work as it humanely possible.
I am sure, though, that YOU will choose carefully a charity to give your money to. All the best to you!
Julia -
mspacman wrote: Just like RL's contributions. Making money is is primary reason for the apparel. Making piddly donations off each shirt is a secondary reason.
Is making 'piddly donations' off each shirts as a second reason such a bad thing?
I don't think that showing some generosity is bad - even if it does bring you more business. Its the way this give and take world works.
IMO it's much better to be contributing a little - rather than being a selfish greedy hog and take take take!c) You're saying the same thing as when wearing any other Ralph Lauren item: "Look at me, I can afford RL, aren't you impressed?"
It sounds like you think people who wear RL are rich, greedy people who have snooty attitudes, are not capable of showing some compassion and only care about looks.
Are you going to judge somebody's personality according to what they own and wear?
It may be not so hard to think - people buy RL Pink Pony because they enjoy fashion and they can contribute to a cause they believe in at the same time.
Yes they can afford it, just because they are earning lots of money doesn't mean they hog it all to themselves in vainity.
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<<< Is making 'piddly donations' off each shirts as a second reason such a bad thing? >>>
No, but that's not what we were discussing. I thought the topic was selling PP without making a 10% donation to charity. If the product is counterfeit, the whole argument is moot anyhow, isn't it? Or are only counterfeits that don't promise a charitable donation OK, LOL.
<<< It sounds like you think people who wear RL are rich, greedy people who have snooty attitudes, are not capable of showing some compassion and only care about looks. >>>
Not at all. 1) I would not judge wealth by something as superficial as clothing. Big hat, no cattle and all that. But again, what's that got to do with anything? I'd think that someone who was REALLY concerned about a donation being made from their purchase would buy from a bona fide RL store, not an eBay seller. Of course, if that eBay seller is claiming to make the donation, either explicitly or implicitly, that's fraudulent.
2) RL is a second-rate product, anyhow, and their shoddy shirts can be bought at Sam's Club.
<<< people buy RL Pink Pony because they enjoy fashion and they can contribute to a cause they believe in at the same time. >>>
I'm sure some people do. But I wouldn't say everyone does. Are you as upset with the buyers who don't care as you are with the sellers? -
mspacman wrote: I'd think that someone who was REALLY concerned about a donation being made from their purchase would buy from a bona fide RL store, not an eBay seller. Of course, if that eBay seller is claiming to make the donation, either explicitly or implicitly, that's fraudulent.
Yes i agree that somebody who geniunely wants to make a donation should buy from the actual Store.
But some people on eBay probably wouldn't know better according to the way it's been advertised.
And i was going a little side tracked - deviating into the consumer point of view..
however, back to topic...
Pink Pony Products represent RL contribution to Breast Cancer Charity Foundation.
Questioning your Conscience is what this is about?
Are you as a seller going to take advantage of this marketing campaign for Charity, use it to make money for yourself, and not donate a single cent?
Are you also going to sell countefeits and do double the damage?
1) Consumer thinks they are Authentic
2) No money is being donated.
Manufacturers/wholesalers/sellers of fakes - should really consider how they are taking advantage of a charity. -
Are you as a seller going to take advantage of this marketing campaign for Charity, use it to make money for yourself, and not donate a single cent?
To make it clear - I am NOT a seller of Ralph Lauren products, Pink Pony included.
I would slightly rewrite the question, though:
Are you as a seller going to take advantage of this marketing Campaign for Ralph Lauren public image, more profit and less taxes for his Company, and not donate a single cent to researches you know nothing about that could be useless or potentially harmful?
The answer would be:
Could I, please, decide for myself what charities to donate my money to? -
I guess not everybody believes RL's intentions are true to the Breast Cancer foundation.
People with selfish objectives ruin the charity and good intentions they have. One person can ruin the reputation of a worthy company and break peoples trust and faith.
Many of us are more fortunate than others. We can't go through life thinking all charities and marketing champaigns for charity are a scam!
Blackcatcrazy - are you suggesting the sales of pink pony items, then choosing a charity in which you personally believe in?
If that were to happen i would think it's very noble and honest. Also a better alternative.
Better than those who don't donate at all.
But I guess the point that Pink Pony is suppose to represent Breast Cancer is just a lost cause. -
Blackcatcrazy - are you suggesting the sales of pink pony items, then choosing a charity in which you personally believe in?
YES!!!
And I want to think that's what Zhenjie is going to do, because I came to trust him more than Ralph Lauren's and the Breast cancer Foundation's.
Also, the point is valid for any earnings, not only made from the Pink Pony. -
Another point is that those people, who would never donate a penny for any cause, should not be a reason to policing everybody selling Pink Pony or anything else, for this matter.
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blackcatcrazy wrote:Another point is that those people, who would never donate a penny for any cause, should not be a reason to policing everybody selling Pink Pony or anything else, for this matter.
I don't think anybody is wanting to police the sales of Pink Pony.
It's just a question of a person's integrity who is currently selling or planning to sell Pink Pony.
I would really like to know somebody who is currently dealing with Pink Pony what their thoughts are - and whether or not they are moved by what as been discussed so far. -
blackcatcrazy wrote:Blackcatcrazy - are you suggesting the sales of pink pony items, then choosing a charity in which you personally believe in?
YES!!!
And I want to think that's what Zhenjie is going to do, because I came to trust him more than Ralph Lauren's and the Breast cancer Foundation's.
Also, the point is valid for any earnings, not only made from the Pink Pony.
Quite frankly, I will NEVER EVER deal in Pink Pony again as it is plain and simply WRONG. No matter how much you want to justify it saying the Breast Cancer foundation is wrong and such (which it may or may not be, but that isn't the debate).
I can honestly say that all the Pink Pony sellers that I have talked too have not donated a single cent from their profit. Most had '10% of funds donated to charity' in their auctions.
If you read the tags and booklet that comes with every Pink Pony time, you will see that all of them say that money was donated with your purchase of this Pink Pony shirt. -
Lying and deceiving IS wrong!
I just did a quick search on eBay. Of 300+ Pink Ponies listed I have checked about a half.
There is one seller, who sells a lot of PP and claims donating 10% to a charity. It would be interesting to contact him/her from a listing to ask a direct question about this. Maybe, I'll do it later today. The seller's ID is designgold-usa.
A couple of sellers mention the fact that the shirts are dedicated to fighting breast and other cancers. One seller lists a lot of cancer fighting resources in her listing. All the others mention nothing.
It is funny, how I can not put up with slightest limitations, restrictions, and policing whatever noble goal they may pursue. I am agree some rules and regulations are necessary to make things work, but for me the less the better. It is a pity humankind still is not grown up enough to do right things voluntarily.
Julia -
America as a whole has just become a decaying society of people just looking out for themselves. It makes my dear parents who were children during the depression sick to see how our society is today. I honestly think this country has about 30 years left before it is just another 3rd world country which some areas of our big cities have already become. IT can be blamed on corporate America and the likes of George Bush who let them run rampant and lay off people to import jobs to Chin and Mexico and such but the blame also falls upon us. The people of this country have become fat,lazy , complacent people who are morally bankrupt. I mean turn on the television sometime and see how every television show has a fruitcake character it is being shoved down the kids throats that it is acceptable behavior. GOD HELP US ALL!!!!!!
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